Your Source for DIY Pedal PCBs and NostalgiTone! › GuitarPCB Forum › General DIY Pedal Discussion › Testing and Identifying Ge and Si Diodes
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Cybercow.
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November 5, 2020 at 3:42 pm #15616
Big OParticipantI have some questionable Ge diodes, so I thought I would test to see if they were truly Ge or not. Using the tips from Barry’s video on diode testing I proceeded to go about checking the forward voltages using my Peak Atlas DCA55, just like in the video. However, I came up with some head scratching results.
First of all, my DCA55 registers voltages out to 3 digits compared to Barry’s in the video that registers voltages out to 2 digits, so obviously I probably have a later version of the DCA55. Testing a diode labeled 1N34, which may have come from BYOC or Mammoth, I get a forward voltage of slightly >0.8 volts which appears to put it in a likely Si diode territory. Testing with a couple of other different regular multimeters, the forward voltage measures slightly >0.4V, which are consistent with each other and more typical of a Ge diode. Maybe the DCA55 is doubling the forward voltage measurement somehow? I do notice that the test current on the DCA55 varies between ~4.1mA to 4.3mA and is not consistent from one measurement to the next. Reference known Ge diodes from Small Bear measure around 0.3V using both the DCA55 and the other two multimeters, which is puzzling compared to the supposed 1N34 measurements relative to the different devices.
Using the DCA55 and warming up (between fingers for ~25 sec.) the known Ge reference diode for a short period of time does produce a drop of 0.010V to 0.015V, but the same is true for the 1N34 and also a Si diode. Using the other multimeters, the Ge reference diode and the 1n34 have ~0.020V drops in forward voltage, and the Si registers a 0.005 drop so there is a ~0.015V difference between the Ge and Si diodes. I also chilled the diodes with a cold pack and came up with similar results, except there was an increase in forward voltage. The increase was not that different when measuring with the DCA55, but was pretty significant with the other multimeters increasing ~0.050V for the Ge diodes and <0.005V for the Si diodes.
My conclusion is that for determining Si vs. Ge, the DCA55 is not helpful. Using my other multimeters, it does appear that I can distinguish between Ge and Si diodes. It also seems that chilling the diodes makes it easier since the voltage change is greater than using the heat method for the Ge diodes and negligible for the Si diodes.
I appear to have confirmed that the 1N34 labeled diode is indeed Ge. Other diodes I have purchased as 1N34’s test as silicon and close inspection with strong magnification reveals these are 1n4733 diodes. These were obtained from Mammoth and probably a reason why they are out of business. I never checked these after I bought them about 4-5 years ago and should have. Other diodes I have are also mislabeled. A pair of 1n914’s from BYOC and a sealed package of 1N914’s from Radio Shack are revealed to be 1N4148’s under magnification, although apparently 1N914’s and 1N4148’s are nearly identical.
If anyone has an idea why the DCA55 has trouble evaluating the diodes would be greatly appreciated. I just know I cannot reproduce Barry’s results; however, it appears that my other multimeters work fine for diode evaluation.
November 5, 2020 at 6:42 pm #15621
CybercowParticipantUsing voltage measurements for Ge diodes alone does not tell the whole story. With my DCA75 I can curve-trace diodes and have seen many out-of-spec Ge diodes that measure above 0.5V for their Fvd – BUT – their respective traced curves suggest that they are indeed Ge diodes. Si diodes have a sharper knee in their curve and Ge diodes have a gentler slope to their curves. So while a Ge diode may display Fvd of ~0.8v, it may well actually be Ge. The curve-rtrac chart below may be beneficial.
Note (specifically) AK-3, which is a NOS Ge diode acquired from eBay. It reads about 0.8v Fvd (at 5mA) but retains the Ge notable softer knee in its curve.
November 5, 2020 at 7:52 pm #15623
Big OParticipantCybercrow, I realize that some Ge diodes can have a forward voltage around that of a Si diode. The thing that is head scratching to me is that my DCA55 measures forward voltage of the 1N34 at around 0.8V and my other multimeters measures the same diode around 0.4V. I can’t figure out why that is. All other diodes I analyzed had comparable measurements with the DCA55 and the other multimeters.
I will say I enjoyed your post on clipping diodes and curve tracking. It was very informative.
November 5, 2020 at 8:10 pm #15625
CybercowParticipantBig-O, the DCA55 & DCA75 are more sophisticated testing devices than the typical DMM. Each DMM make & model will have a specific means and current level with which to test PN junctions – different from that of the Peak Atlas devices. The DCA testing devices also sweep a current range across the PN junction(s) while testing components before rendering a conclusion. The typical DMM uses a fixed current when measuring PN junctions. At least, that’s the best explanation I can surmise.
November 5, 2020 at 10:04 pm #15633
Big OParticipantThanks for the possible explanation. I figured it might have something to do with how the DCA devices accomplish their analytic functions versus the DMM’s.
I was thinking about getting a DCA75, but figured I didn’t need the extra fancy smancy curve functions for the additional cost involved. I will stick with the DCA55. Of course my best friend from college, a EE, thinks I should be using an oscilloscope.
November 5, 2020 at 10:20 pm #15634
CybercowParticipantWe do our best with what resource we have available. Build on! 😉
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